Author Topic: Isa 42:17 "images"  (Read 118 times)

Offline cizz

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Isa 42:17 "images"
« on: September 02, 2011, 07:21:42 am »
Blessings everyone!

You know I find it strange all the things we can over look and simply forget to consider, like all the meanings of the word 'image'..

Man is made in the image..tselem, which is a noun but acts as a verb...to shade or shadow forth, casting a shadow...

Then we have the meaning of ...how do you say it, "got to keep up the image!" which is maskiyth , means show piece, imagination, carved figure, wish and conceit...

Then there is image pecel which is graven image...something fashioned by the hands and then bowed down too..
Why most people have assumed that this is only speaking of statues is beyond me..

Isa 42:17 They shall be turned back, they shall be greatly ashamed , that trust in graven images, that say to the molten images, Ye [are] our gods.

How can one image say to another, you are a god?...fashioned by the hand usually onto something...like writing words, graven onto a piece of paper that say to the other image (and in this case the image is maccekah , which is libation, rituial preformances), you're god!!

I have some very superstitious people in my life <no joke> they really believe that the bible (a book) is so sacred that they freak out when they see where I have wrote in mine...ewwww shame on me! That is silly! If I wear this one out or something happens to it, I will go buy another and if they stop selling bibles or for some reason we just run out of them, then we can all get together and recite what we know and remember was written in it, we can even write it back down on something since we are in a tempary state of being and leave it for the next generation...

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Offline cizz

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Re: Isa 42:17 "images"
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2011, 08:51:03 pm »
I wanted to take a closer look at this word "pecel" (graven image)

Graven can also mean "something firmly fixed" like something etched or graven in the mind...

It's not surpising that the ancient Hebrews thought of the mind as also being the heart (understanding or thoughts)..

Zec 7:12 Yea, they made their hearts [as] an adamant stone, lest they should hear the law, and the words which the LORD of hosts hath sent in his spirit by the former prophets: therefore came a great wrath from the LORD of hosts.

« Last Edit: September 10, 2011, 07:26:30 pm by cizz »

Offline cizz

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Re: Isa 42:17 "images"
« Reply #2 on: September 08, 2011, 07:08:53 pm »
Quote
Isa 42:17 They shall be turned back, they shall be greatly ashamed , that trust in graven images, that say to the molten images, Ye [are] our gods.

How can one image say to another, you are a god?...fashioned by the hand usually onto something...like writing words, graven onto a piece of paper that say to the other image (and in this case the image is maccekah , which is libation, rituial preformances), you're god!!

Okay, a closer look at the word "maccekah"..

a pouring, libation, molten metal, cast image, drink offering
web, covering, veil, woven stuff

Translated as:
image 18, molten 7, covering 2, vail 1


Isa 30:1 Woe to the rebellious children, saith the LORD, that take counsel, but not of me; and that cover with a covering, but not of my spirit, that they may add sin to sin: 

Hsa 13:2 And now they sin more and more , and have made them molten images of their silver, [and] idols according to their own understanding, all of it the work of the craftsmen: they say of them, Let the men that sacrifice kiss the calves.
 
*In our modern world and in the Greek standards..we are craftsmen of words...we no longer use contrete things like wood and stones to carve our images...we use words, concepts and imagination and once we have conjured the image we then pour out and cover it with "lofty statis from judgement of it being worthy"


What I find fascinating is the root word this maccekah comes off of, nacak

to pour out, pour, offer, cast,
*to be anointed
*to pour out (as a libation)
*to pour out libations
*to be poured out

to set, install
*to install
*to be installed


« Last Edit: September 08, 2011, 07:22:13 pm by cizz »

Offline cizz

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Re: Isa 42:17 "images"
« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2011, 02:47:11 am »
Quote
*In our modern world and in the Greek standards..we are craftsmen of words...we no longer use contrete things like wood and stones to carve our images...we use words, concepts and imagination and once we have conjured the image we then pour out and cover it with "lofty statis from judgement of it being worthy"

Isa 44:10 Who hath formed a god, or molten a graven image [that] is profitable for nothing?

Offline cizz

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Re: Isa 42:17 "images"
« Reply #4 on: September 15, 2011, 02:18:41 am »
Genesis 1:27
By Jeff A. Benner


http://www.ancient-hebrew.org/40_genesis1.html


And God created man in his own image
 

God (Strong's #430)
The Hebrew word אלהים (elohiym) is the plural form of אלוה (elo'ah) literally meaning "strength" and "power" and is usually translated as God or god. The ים is the masculine plural suffix and when added to this word becomes אלהים (elohiym) which is usually translated as gods or judges as they are strong and powerful ones. But it is also commonly used for God as a name because he is "thee" strong and powerful one.

Create (Strong's #1254)
The Hebrew word behind created is the Hebrew verb ברא (bara). The idea of "creating" is an abstract thought that is foreign to Hebrew thought. The concrete understanding behind this word can be seen in 1 Samuel 2:29, "Why do you honor your sons more than me by fattening yourselves on the choice parts of every offering made by my people Israel?" In this passage is the word "fattening" which is the same Hebrew verb ברא (bara). By extension this word also means to "fill up."

Man (Strong's #120)
The Hebrew word for man is אדם (adam) and is also the name of the first man.

Image (Strong's #6754)
The word צלם (tselem) is literally a shadow which is the outline or representation of the original.


And Elohiym, the Great Powerful One, filled the man with a representation of himself
 

When we read "And God created man in his own image" our minds form a mental picture of what we look like and then attribute this picture to God himself. In the Hebrews mind it is not the appearance of something that they concentrate on but its function. This passage is not implying a picture of man or God but their function. Through the Hebrew words of this text we see that God had placed within man a shadow or representation of his own function - goal, purpose, thought, etc. It is our responsibility to live our lives as representatives of God, acting in the same manner as he would.

Offline cizz

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Re: Isa 42:17 "images"
« Reply #5 on: September 15, 2011, 02:23:39 am »
Quote
*In our modern world and in the Greek standards..we are craftsmen of words...we no longer use contrete things like wood and stones to carve our images...we use words, concepts and imagination and once we have conjured the image we then pour out and cover it with "lofty statis from judgement of it being worthy"


Exodus 20:7
By Jeff A. Benner

http://www.ancient-hebrew.org/40_exodus1.html

You shall not take the name of the LORD your God in vain
 

Take (Strong's #5375)
The Hebrew verb behind this English word is נשא (nasa) and is a very generic verb used in a wide variety ways in the text. This word has been translated as lift, carry, accept, exalt, regard, obtain, respect and many other ways. In the context of this verse it is the "name" that is being "lifted up." One lifts up a name by making it known to others.



Name (Strong's #8034)
In our modern western culture a name is nothing more than an identifier, really no different than being assigned a number. The Hebrew word for a name is שם (shem) But, in the Ancient Hebrews culture the "shem" is much more than just a name it is the "breath" of the individual. To the Hebrews the breath is more than just the exchange of air in the lungs it is his "character," the internal qualities of an individual that make him unique. This idea of the word shem meaning character can be seen in 1 Kings 4:31, "and his fame was in all the nations round about." Here, the word fame is understood as his "character."

All Hebrew names are words with meaning and these words reflects their characters. For instance, Eve (Hhavah in Hebrew) means "life" because she is the mother of all the living (Hhay, a related word to Hhavah, see Genesis 3:20). The names for God is no different. The name Yahweh means "he exists" and God (Elohiym) means "one of power and authority." Some other names of God include "Jealous" (Exodus 34:14), "One" (Zechariah 14:9 which literally reads "his name is one"), Holy (Isaiah 57:15) and others. What is God's name? Most will answer with Yahweh or God but we must remember that a name or shem in Hebrew is the character of the individual so the correct question should be "What is God's character?"



Vain (Strong's #7723)
The third word that we need to understand correctly is the word "vain." This is the Hebrew word שוא (sheva). This word literally means "empty" and vain actions are empty of substance. This word can also be understood as "falsely" in the sense of being empty of its true substance. This idea can be seen in Exodus 23:1, "You shall not utter a false report." The word "false" is the very same Hebrew word שוא (sheva).

Now that we have a more complete understanding of the words in the passage we are able to make a more Hebraic interpretation.

You shall not represent the character of Elohiym Falsely  

So, what does this mean? In another study we saw that when it says "God created man in his own image" it is in fact saying that God had placed within us a representation of himself. This representation is his shem or character and we are to show this character to others. If however, we represent that character falsely, in other words live our lives contrary to the character of God, then we are violating this command.